Ok, I’ll bite, I had dismissed this email/website (very bottom of this post)as soon as I read it. Then, numerous emails came into my inbox asking me if this was legit. My findings, no, the VA isn’t hammering vets to take away their guns. No Marines, sailors I know on the east or left coast or even veterans out of the service have received these as the email promulgates its mass distribution.
Did this person actually get this letter from the VA?
Perhaps, and perhaps he needs to be restrained from firearms, I don’t know his
situation. What I do know, is this should not prevent any warrior that needs help
from getting it. If your a reader and you know of the "masses" recieving these and could put me in touch with them, then I may change my mind. However, until then, I would say this is a far and few situation.
This post is to give you the reader all of the info to make an educated decision) They sky isn’t falling, not yet at least.
Time for a C-Gar
Don’t beleive the hype on the VA letter summarily denying vets gun rights
I read the claim yesterday as it floated around the internet:
How would you feel if you received a letter from the U.S. Government informing you that because of a physical or mental condition that the government says you have it is proposing to rule that you are incompetent to handle your own financial affairs? Suppose that letter also stated that the government is going to appoint a stranger to handle your affairs for you at your expense? That would certainly be scary enough but it gets worse.
What if that letter also stated: “A determination of incompetency will prohibit you from purchasing, possessing, receiving, or transporting a firearm or ammunition. If you knowingly violate any of these prohibitions, you may be fined, imprisoned, or both pursuant to the Brady Handgun Violence Prevention Act, Pub.L.No. 103-159, as implemented at 18, United States Code 924(a)(2).”?
That makes is sound like something right from a documentary on a tyrannical dictatorship somewhere in the world. Yet, as I write this I have a copy of such a letter right in front of me. It is being sent by the U.S. Department of Veterans Affairs to hundreds, perhaps thousands, of America’s heroes. In my capacity as Executive Director of the United States Justice Foundation (USJF) I have been contacted by some of these veterans and the stories I am getting are appalling.
I have no idea who Michael Connelly is, but I can tell you this: his story is misleading at best, and purposeful fear-mongering at worst.
Connelly lays this out in such a way that the average person reading this gets the impression that the VA is arbitrarily sending letters to unsuspecting veterans that they’ve lost their 2nd Amendment rights because someone in far away Washington summarily checked a box on a whim. It is portrayed as a bolt from the blue, affecting a large percentage of veterans.
What is really going on is that if a veteran is having financial problems, someone, usually his immediate family, can request for his benefits to be placed in guardianship. It allows the VA to pay the family so that they can handle a disabled vet’s finances and get his bills paid. When a veteran’s affairs are placed in guardianship, then this provision kicks in.
This doesn’t happen to someone just because they went into combat, or if they have some level of PTSD, or if they have a head injury. This generally applies to folks that are seriously mentally compromised. It applies to guys who are, as one veteran’s expert informed me this morning:
“…either comatose, make poor life decisions, spend their VA check on drugs, or (like the guy I once represented) were pissed off that the T-Rex in the back yard was eating his vegetables.”
Now, what happens if someone is placed on this list who feels he doesn’t deserve it? They can get a hearing, provide evidence, etc. and get their day in court to have their Second Amendment rights restored via due process.
Now, is this an ideal and perfect process? Of course not. It has humans involved in trying to figured out the messy workings of someone else’s gray matter, and that is an iffy proposition that MDs and PhDs that work directly with patients for years still get wrong from time to time.
But it’s a far cry from what people are choosing to read into this, which is that the VA is arbitrarily disarming vets on a whim.
and
http://twitchy.com/2013/02/22/no-the-va-isnt-arbitrarily-disarming-veterans/
The original email/website about the Gov taking away Veterans guns:
Written By Constitutional Attorney Michael Connelly, J.D.
How would you feel if you received a letter from the U.S. Government informing you that because of a physical or mental condition that the government says you have it is proposing to rule that you are incompetent to handle your own financial affairs? Suppose that letter also stated that the government is going to appoint a stranger to handle your affairs for you at your expense? That would certainly be scary enough but it gets worse.
What if that letter also stated: “A determination of incompetency will prohibit you from purchasing, possessing, receiving, or transporting a firearm or ammunition. If you knowingly violate any of these prohibitions, you may be fined, imprisoned, or both pursuant to the Brady Handgun Violence Prevention Act, Pub.L.No. 103-159, as implemented at 18, United States Code 924(a)(2).”?
That makes is sound like something right from a documentary on a tyrannical dictatorship somewhere in the world. Yet, as I write this I have a copy of such a letter right in front of me. It is being sent by the U.S. Department of Veterans Affairs to hundreds, perhaps thousands, of America’s heroes. In my capacity as Executive Director of the United States Justice Foundation (USJF) I have been contacted by some of these veterans and the stories I am getting are appalling.
The letter provides no specifics on the reasons for the proposed finding of incompetency; just that is based on a determination by someone in the VA. In every state in the United States no one can be declared incompetent to administer their own affairs without due process of law and that usually requires a judicial hearing with evidence being offered to prove to a judge that the person is indeed incompetent. This is a requirement of the Fifth Amendment to the U.S. Constitution that states that no person shall “… be deprived of life, liberty, or property without due process of law…”.
Obviously, the Department of Veterans Affairs can’t be bothered by such impediments as the Constitution, particularly since they are clearly pushing to fulfill one of Obama’s main goals, the disarming of the American people. Janet Napolitano has already warned law enforcement that some of the most dangerous among us are America’s heroes, our veterans, and now according to this letter from the VA they can be prohibited from buying or even possessing a firearm because of a physical or mental disability.
Think about it, the men and women who have laid their lives on the line to defend us and our Constitution are now having their own Constitutional rights denied. There are no clear criteria for the VA to declare a veteran incompetent. It can be the loss of a limb in combat, a head injury, a diagnosis of PTSD, or even a soldier just telling someone at the VA that he or she is depressed over the loss of a buddy in combat. In none of these situations has the person been found to be a danger to themselves or others. If that was the case than all of the Americans who have suffered from PTSD following the loss of a loved one or from being in a car accident would also have to be disqualified from owning firearms. It would also mean that everyone who has ever been depressed for any reason should be disarmed. In fact, many of the veterans being deprived of their rights have no idea why it is happening.
The answer seems to be it is simply because they are veterans. At the USJF we intend to find the truth by filing a Freedom of Information Act request to the Department of Veterans Affairs to force them to disclose the criteria they are using to place veterans on the background check list that keeps them from exercising their Second Amendment rights. Then we will take whatever legal steps are necessary to protect our American warriors.
The reality is that Obama will not get all of the gun control measures he wants through Congress, and they wouldn’t be enough for him anyway. He wants a totally disarmed America so there will be no resistance to his plans to rob us of our nation. That means we have to ask who will be next. If you are receiving a Social Security check will you get one of these letters? Will the government declare that you are incompetent because of your age and therefore banned from firearm ownership. It certainly fits in with the philosophy and plans of the Obama administration. It is also certain that our military veterans don’t deserve this and neither do any other Americans.
-- Michael Connelly, J.D.
Dear Blogger,
I would like to repectfully submit the following questions:
If the veteran is having financial problems,how can he pay to go to a hearing? If this is so rare, why is there a form letter? Why don't they state the problme in the letter?
Make poor life decisions? What does that mean, not voting for a Republican?
What is the name of your veteran expert? What makes him an expert?
We've all seen the letter... can you give us any facts to back up what you are saying?
Yours Truly,
Not Convinced
Posted by: Rose Banks | February 24, 2013 at 07:45 AM
Hoax?
Posted by: anon | February 24, 2013 at 09:45 AM
Major:
I passed this one by a friend of mine who works in Benefits for the VA here in the DFW area, her comments:
"I haven't heard about this one yet. I do have to say that in four and a half years of reviewing Veterans' files, I have only seen a handful that were declared incompetent, and those were mainly requested by a spouse or adult child to be declared because of memory issues. Sometimes due to Alzheimer's and sometimes due to drug abuse. I've never seen incompetency due to the loss of a limb? Incompetence is declared by VA doctors though, and most of them won't unless it's obviously needed. A diagnosis of PTSD doesn't mean you are incompetent.".
'Nuff said, this is obviously the loons letting loose....
Posted by: Texas Renegade | February 24, 2013 at 02:07 PM
Not Convinced?
1) See above
2) Anyone with a word processing program later than 1995 can produce a form letter - ever heard of phishing???
Posted by: Texas Renegade | February 24, 2013 at 02:10 PM
Not Convinced - was this letter to you? Are you the guy mentioned? If not, have you recieved one of these? Do you know anyone who has? Have you actually seen it? Like the Maj posted, this is one blog that posted the letter and many other blogs that refer back to that blog. If it were numerous blogs posting about it with different names on the letters equating to "numerous" letters being sent, that would support your thoughts. However, again like the Maj said, until someone can come forward and tell us that "here are a bunch of examples" we have to keep this one in perspective. I think the Maj is a big gun proponent, the last thing he wants is for someone to give up their weapon unwarrented. Just saying.
Posted by: Tim | February 24, 2013 at 06:11 PM
Not convinced where do you get that the veteran is in financial problems and where dod you get he has to go for a hearing ?
You are talkingtwo different issues and trying to mix them together
One is if he is not paying his bills,spending his money wrecklessly orshowing any other signs of a problem of handling his money ,then a parent ,a wife,a sister or even a friend can submit to the Va to appoint someone in charge of his affairs.
He can submit a request for a hearing .That can be done by phone or in person or maybe in some casses by mail. If there should be a hearing it would be held somewhere with in reason of where he lives.
In most casses he would be either given the funds to make the trip or will be paid when he gets there with his receipts for the trip
Th eother part is the firearms part. This is not anything new as the Michael Connelys of the world would lead you to believe. These letters havebeen around for pprobably 15 yeras or more.
Again the VA does not just say you can't have a firearm. It is usually after a loved one has requested that you are no longer competent to have one and the VA after an investigation agrees ,then the letter is sent .You have the right to appeal that as well as a decision is not made that is why it says "if found" not "you have been found" incompetent. They have to wait on your appeal and a hearing with you and then and only then is a decision made. The other way you get the letter is if you answered questions when trying to get VA health care and these questions were such as I have memories of wantingto kill,I get so mad I do not remember anything and I get violent ,I get mad and threaten people. Then there is a investigation to see if you are mentally incompetent if so again the letter is sent and it still says "if " not "were" after an appeal and hearing
There has been nothing aboutthis on any of the mainstream news media that is because one there is nothing to it and second the letter has been around for years
Just like others have said as well,it may even be fake ones floating around hoping someone will answer with a lot of personal info.
Look how many people just return replies of email form their bank only to find out it is a scam
Hope this clears it up some for you
Posted by: Doc | February 25, 2013 at 10:14 AM
Glad you are looking into this, and being calm and raional :)
Posted by: MINDY1 | February 25, 2013 at 10:58 AM
Should have said RATIONAL
Posted by: MINDY1 | February 25, 2013 at 10:59 AM
Connelly's letter is more true than you think. I know because I have received the letter from the V A proposing I am incompetent. They stated as the reason is that I have seizures they call epilepsy. I have never been diagnosed with having epilepsy so I consider their reasoning as pure bunk! I had a stroke in 2002 resulting absence seizures. The neurologist put me on medication that completely controlled them to the point I haven't had one in years.
As soon as I got the V A letter I took it to my VFW Veteran Service Officer. She immediately fired off a letter saying I was not incompetent. To further prove my point, she also sent letters of support from the Commander of my VFW Post and my District VFW Commander. I have held many offices in my VFW Post including Post Commander and eleven years as Post Adjutant. Currently I am a Trustee with the responsibility of insuring the post financial records are in order. I am also an officer on VFW District Level, and am responsible for twenty three VFW Posts. I have been informed I am receiving an award for VFW Outstanding District Officer in my state. I say this not to brag, but to prove my point that I am not incompetent.
If other veterans are experiencing the same ordeal as me . I truely pray for them.
Posted by: Larry E. Hardison | February 25, 2013 at 10:04 PM
Larry- First, thank you for your service. Second, you proved our point and I bet you still have a weapon. Stay safe soldier!
Posted by: James | February 26, 2013 at 09:29 AM
This is put out by the Tea Party and the NRA to get people riled up, mainly veterans. It's BS. The VA has enough on it's hands without getting millions of vets riled up. It's a part of their plan to fight gun control no matter what side you are on.
Posted by: William Ricketts | February 28, 2013 at 10:42 AM
I heard this at a Vets meeting. the counselor said it was true and here's a link to am image of the letter.
http://static.squarespace.com/static/4f34530ecb12e336a9dfe29c/t/5127fe2ae4b0706f4bc5fa50/1361575466089/VA-letter%20Copy%20by%20RedFlag%20News.pdf
Posted by: JohnR | February 28, 2013 at 04:43 PM
Sorry William, but everything I posted is happening to me and to other vets. It is BS, but it is BS against veterans by the V A and the government.
Posted by: Larry E. Hardison | March 01, 2013 at 12:36 PM
After a Combat Veterans International meeting yesterday, we heard that form letter was mailed to many in the group and my husband received one. After reading about it here & elsewhere, I came to the conclusion that it is a precurser to further gun control legislation. A veiled threat with no teeth in it, yet. . .
Posted by: Lorraine | March 04, 2013 at 11:28 AM
Lorraine, did your husband receive a phone call from the V A advising him of being proposed as incompetent, followed with a letter? In my case it is no veiled threat. The V A has sent me a letter saying they propose to rate me incompetent as a result of a C&P examination. The examiner notified the V A that I have siezures (epilepsy), and has given me 60 days to respond or be tagged as incompetent, I haven't had a siezure in years, and I am certainly not an epileptic. My Service Officer is taking my situation very seriously, and is fighting hard to prove I'm competent.
I surely hope in your husband's case everything is o.k.
Posted by: Larry E. Hardison | March 05, 2013 at 12:42 AM
I am 100 percent for ptsd p/t and just got granted aid and attendance got unofficial letter saying a finding of incompetency is proposed whats up with that
Posted by: rico richardson | March 10, 2013 at 12:22 AM
After reading the letter that someone kindly linked to, I have some ideas. First, sure it is a form letter to ensure it says exactly what the VA wants it to say as clearly as possible. But as the letter shows, it does give the specifics for the person. Second, the primary purpose of the letter is for the VA to declare the person incapable of handling the money the VA is giving. I am not so sure that is a bad idea but would want to know if it is legal for the VA to be concerned once they give the money. As for the reference to the Brady Act and gun ownership prohibition, consider this - maybe this VA warning is intended to ensure the person is aware of an issue that the VA does not even support. Maybe the VA doesn't even think this particular aspect of the Brady Act is right and the real action to take is amend the Brady Act.
Posted by: Bob Gray | March 10, 2013 at 07:35 AM
Things maybe looking up for me concerning the V A's proposal to rate me as incompetent. This week I had a V A mental health appointment and the doctor who did the examination told me there is no basis for ruling me as incompetent. He told me to have my Veteran Service Officer call him, and he would write a letter of support for me explaining his findings. I beleive there is a light at the end of the tunnel now, however, the government works in strange ways so I guess I'll just have to wait to see what happens.
Posted by: Larry E. Hardison | March 10, 2013 at 11:11 PM
What you all seem to be missing is this...under the 5th Amendment...only a COURT OF LAW can find you incompetent. You cannot be deprived of life, liberty of pursuit of happiness without due process of law. It is also in your individual state constitutions. The VA cannot unilaterally declare you incompetent as even though you ust the VA for medical reasons, and have a compensation/pension from them, you are no longer in the service and are a civilian and to take away your 5th Amendment right is beyond the scope of the VA's abilities! And what does a physical disability have to do with incompetence? The letter states: This evidence indicates that you are not able to handle your VA benefit payments because of a physical or mental condition. Our veterans have paid a high enough price for their service, let's not make them pay more. It has NOTHING to do with liberals wanting to take away our guns, nor conservatives trying to make the 2nd Amendment an issue....and everything to do with our brave servicemen and women having their constitutional rights violated. I respect you, my brother...but even if just a handful of us are receiving this, it isn't right and we need to leave no soldier behind on this battlefield!
A Sister Marine
Posted by: Debby Reagan | March 18, 2013 at 07:01 PM
The VA cannot unilaterally declare you incompetent as, even though you use the VA for medical reasons, and have a compensation/pension from them,you are no longer in the service and are a civilian and to take away your 5th Amendment right is beyond the scope of the VA's abilities! (Sorry, somehow this sentence got messed up in my first post).
Posted by: Debby Reagan | March 18, 2013 at 07:04 PM
6I have read many articles about this topic this past weekend and it seems that people either believe it or they don't. So I researched the current legislation and I found that a Texas Republican (Steve Stockman) is pushing Bill H.R. 577 Veterans Second Amendment Protection Act, and a Florida Republican (Jeff Miller) is pushing Bill H.R. 602 which is an identical bill. Currently they are the only two listed on the bills as supporters but to me that only means someone hasn't updated the webpage The bills do not mention anything about notifying veterans, but I doubt a bill would be that detailed anyway. These are the only bills that I found that refer to the VA and weapons.
Here is a copy and paste of the the actual bill H.R. 577; "2/6/2013--Introduced. Veterans Second Amendment Protection Act - Prohibits, in any case arising out of the administration of laws and benefits by the Secretary of Veterans Affairs (VA), considering any person who is mentally incapacitated, deemed mentally incompetent, or experiencing an extended loss of consciousness from being considered adjudicated as a mental defective for purposes of the right to receive or transport firearms without the order or finding of a judicial authority of competent jurisdiction that such person is a danger to himself or herself or others."
Posted by: Ryan Hall | March 18, 2013 at 11:45 PM
And there wouldn't be any need for these bills to be introduced if this wasn't happening! TY Ryan for your research. Now maybe people will believe our veterans instead of putting their belief in a government that is failing its citizens as well as its heroes!
Posted by: Debby Reagan | March 19, 2013 at 08:44 PM
Freaking Awesome!!! Instills continued pride for Vets, serves a trade they are very familiar with, good at and protects soft targets. Additionally provides an immediate job gap
Posted by: Replica Watches uk | April 06, 2013 at 02:14 AM
I received a call from the Philadelphia VA on 20 April 2013 informing me that I am being processed as incompetent, will receive an 80% rating, and will have my right to gbear arms taken from me. I informed her very nicely that I would like to receive this in writing, and she stated it would be forthcoming. I then called the number back, and it was from the Phil VA Regional office.
Posted by: Ken Chrosniak | April 23, 2013 at 02:39 PM